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Descend into the Particular| Revisionist History podcast with Malcolm Gladwell E7/S4 (Transcript)

Descend into the Particular

Episode 7| Season 4| Revisionist History
Length: 42 mins | Released: August 1, 2019

To see the full transcript, go here.

NOTE: Episodes 3 -11 are contained in one interactive project. Click the down arrow to the right of the episode name to select it.

Quick heads up: this episode contains depictions of violence that may be upsetting to some listeners

Malcolm Gladwell: In a small, elegant apartment in Hollywood, a young man sits on his couch looking out the open window, remembering the saddest day of his life. His name is Philippe Navarro, 30 years old, short black hair, a beautiful wide smile.

Philippe Navarro: Angel was my brother. He was my only sibling. We were born exactly like a year and two weeks apart, so my birthday is middle October, and he was born the following year on Halloween.

Malcolm Gladwell: That was the beginning and this was the end.

Philippe Navarro: He died Thursday, May 26, 2016, and it was about to be Friday, Memorial Day weekend and we were not notified until that Sunday morning and they claimed that they couldn’t find us, even though they had his wallet and his student ID. So then come that Sunday, my parents had gone to breakfast and they came back and there’s about four or five cop cars at their home.

Malcolm Gladwell: Angel had been in New Mexico, visiting with a friend. Philippi and their parents were in California. Philippe doesn’t know why it took so long for the New Mexico police to notify them — three days. Didn’t his brother have his ID on him? And even after the police came, the Navarro’s didn’t know what happened to Angel.

Philippe Navarro: I called the detective and every time I spoke to her, they were like, “Unfortunately, like we can’t give you any information because it’s still under investigation,” and everything was always under investigation. And at first, I didn’t really think anything, any sort of malice on the police department because I don’t even think I knew, at that point, that he had been killed by the police, and I certainly didn’t even know the backstory of how he even got into that altercation with the police. I should say incident; not altercation. But I think all I was trying to figure out was what had happened.

Malcolm Gladwell: Angel Navarro was killed by the police on Interstate 25 in New Mexico, outside Albuquerque on May 26, 2016. The officers fired 27 times. They thought Navarro had a gun in his hand. He didn’t; he had a cell phone.

Malcolm Gladwell: My name is Malcolm Gladwell. You’re listening to Revisionist History, my podcast about things overlooked and misunderstood. This is the final episode in my three-part mini-series on thinking like a Jesuit. I will warn you now, what I’m talking about in this episode is not for the faint of heart.

Malcolm Gladwell: I heard about the shooting of Angel Navarro because I went to see a forensic criminologist named Ron Martinelli. Martinelli works out of a white ranch house in Texas Hill Country, half an hour north of San Antonio. He’s in his 60s, built like a prizefighter, bald, thick mustache, pickup truck, likes to be called Dr. Ron. I had been obsessed with a police guideline called the 21-Foot Rule and thought Martinelli could help me. But then we got off on tangents and never returned.

To see the full transcript, go here and select the episode.

Transcripts for the entire Season 1–4 podcasts of Revisionist History are available here.

Simon Says is an automated transcription service. We assist people and companies, such as those in the media, to swiftly transcribe audio and video files so they can find that meaningful dialogue. We are not associated with Revisionist History or Panoply Media; we are just big fans. And we highly recommend you listen to the podcast if you can. We have provided the transcript below as a supplement. Enjoy!